Matrix Revolutions - by Arislyn on 07:24 07 Nov 2003
GENERAL WARNING: Further down in this thread are spoilers. Read at your own risk.
I haven't seen Matrix Revolutions (and don't plan to. I didn't like Reloaded well enough to warrant seeing Revolutions). However, I am curious to find out if anyone here at the boards has seen it and see what they thought about it.
(WARNING: the link below leads to a great, big spolier. If you have not seen the film and are interested in seeing it, DO NOT read SK's review.)
So far, the word on various BBs and blogs have not been all that positive...much like this review from Scott Kurtz of PvP.
GENERAL WARNING: Further down in this thread are spoilers. Read at your own risk.
I haven't seen Matrix Revolutions (and don't plan to. I didn't like Reloaded well enough to warrant seeing Revolutions). However, I am curious to find out if anyone here at the boards has seen it and see what they thought about it.
(WARNING: the link below leads to a great, big spolier. If you have not seen the film and are interested in seeing it, DO NOT read SK's review.)
So far, the word on various BBs and blogs have not been all that positive...much like this review from Scott Kurtz of PvP.
Matrix Revolutions - by Brad on 14:15 07 Nov 2003
Havn't seen it. I still have to rent #2 first. You are right, Ari, most of the reviews are sort of tepid.
Havn't seen it. I still have to rent #2 first. You are right, Ari, most of the reviews are sort of tepid.
Matrix Revolutions - by NoonChild on 11:05 08 Nov 2003
Saw a making of prog last night, and it is obvious that they have created wonderful CGI and motion capture etc. However I didnt like reloaded much and there are apparently flaws in the third film (eg action takes place in the real world but the characteres are still displaying superhuman abilities). Plot problems or weak story often ruins a wonderfully crafted visual feast.
Also we are supposed to accept the CGI as real and we do, so we dont really notice how much work must have been done to create the illusion of reality.
Saw a making of prog last night, and it is obvious that they have created wonderful CGI and motion capture etc. However I didnt like reloaded much and there are apparently flaws in the third film (eg action takes place in the real world but the characteres are still displaying superhuman abilities). Plot problems or weak story often ruins a wonderfully crafted visual feast.
Also we are supposed to accept the CGI as real and we do, so we dont really notice how much work must have been done to create the illusion of reality.
Matrix Revolutions - by Haruchai on 19:20 08 Nov 2003
Well, I saw Revolutions, and thought the ending was kinda... eh. *shrugs*
As far as an action movie, it was pretty cool. But as far as a "Matrix" sequel, I agree with a lot of what Kurtz said. I think they could have come up with a lot better ending, if they'd just have put a bit more thought into it.
Well, I saw Revolutions, and thought the ending was kinda... eh. *shrugs*
As far as an action movie, it was pretty cool. But as far as a "Matrix" sequel, I agree with a lot of what Kurtz said. I think they could have come up with a lot better ending, if they'd just have put a bit more thought into it.
Matrix Revolutions - by Kainja on 01:55 09 Nov 2003
I saw revolutions today and here's my take.
1. I think that if you hadn't seen the first one and therefore had your expectations raised, you'd probably like this third installment as a special effects bonanza. The CGI was great, which was to be expected, and there was some tense scenes where the viewer (at least me) was rooting for the good guys against all odds.
2. The action scenes were not nearly as good as in Matrix 1 and 2, I thought. There were some fight scenes that were just way too comic book superhero for me.
3. There was a fair amount of confusion as to the plot and plot resolutions to me.
4. The opening seemed to have little to do with the basic movie except to provide space for some action, which was not all that great to begin with.
5. At times there was so much CGI on the screen that I got lost in it and couldn't make out quite what was going on.
6. There was some Star Wars influence in some scenes.
7. There was a pretty intense chase scene through the machine underground that I thought was the best part of the film.
8. MY recommendation? I thought it was worth seeing, but I was a bit disappointed because of the incredible promise of the first one. It did deliver entertainment value for the buck, though.
I saw revolutions today and here's my take.
1. I think that if you hadn't seen the first one and therefore had your expectations raised, you'd probably like this third installment as a special effects bonanza. The CGI was great, which was to be expected, and there was some tense scenes where the viewer (at least me) was rooting for the good guys against all odds.
2. The action scenes were not nearly as good as in Matrix 1 and 2, I thought. There were some fight scenes that were just way too comic book superhero for me.
3. There was a fair amount of confusion as to the plot and plot resolutions to me.
4. The opening seemed to have little to do with the basic movie except to provide space for some action, which was not all that great to begin with.
5. At times there was so much CGI on the screen that I got lost in it and couldn't make out quite what was going on.
6. There was some Star Wars influence in some scenes.
7. There was a pretty intense chase scene through the machine underground that I thought was the best part of the film.
8. MY recommendation? I thought it was worth seeing, but I was a bit disappointed because of the incredible promise of the first one. It did deliver entertainment value for the buck, though.
Matrix Revolutions - by Runt on 09:42 10 Nov 2003
ICK.. SPOILERS BELOW.....
Yeah.. ok.. so I dragged Arislyn out to see it yesterday. So much for her not planning on seeing it, eh.
A review... well... what can I say but what was there to expect from two guys who just had to take three movies to prove that they can't write a plot to save their lives. The holes in all THREE movies were large enough to drive a machine city through. Revolutions was funny I'll give it that... I laughed my butt off at the slow-motion Neo punch on Smith... but funny isn't what the matrix was suppose to be.. so it was more laughing AT it instead of WITH it.
Now.. first off... yeah.. it was good eye candy... the first movie was the tastiest of them all... cause the eye candy was new and shiny and devoid of bite marks. Arrays of cameras.. all the dark and moody characters. And this movie had its share... it is worth seeing at a dollar theater if only to see some of the fight scenes with the hovercraft in the mechanical tube and the fights with the squids in the landing bay. Gotta admit.. pretty cool.
But... by Revolutions... it was like someone had offered to give you a piece of candy by spitting out the one they had been sucking on. OH LOOK... they are recreating the fight scene in the lobby of the government building... same columns.. same run and dodge tactics... only this time they are on the ceiling..... somehow it just isn't as cool. So though still interesting in places.. it had long stretches where I didn't mind getting up for more Coke.
And speaking of stretches... sheezz.. one rule of cinema.. no death scene that is to be taken seriously should be longer than Hamlets. Period. ESPECIALLY when there are HUGE METAL PIPES jutting through what would be the diaphragm. At least Hamlet was dying a slow lingering death by poison. Trinity, on the other hand, seemed to not suffer from that whole "need to breathe" thing while uttering her final 12 pages of dialogue.
I'm sure you've read Kurtz comments on making EVERYTHING able to create an EMP pulse. Just one small example of how badly the entire concept was written.
Starting all the way back in the first movie.... Morpheous tells us how the machines lived off of sunlight... energy created by nuclear fusion of the simplest, most basic, low output sort.. Hydrogen smashing into each other to create Helium. So... the humans nuked the world to block out the sun... which deprived them of their power... till they found that humans make good batteries.. when combined with a form of fusion. A form of fusion.. ummm.. that would be what they were USING BEFORE... there is no "form" of fusion that would produce less power than simple hydrogen to helium... they collide or they don't. The humans are what then... a curiosity? They sure as heck don't need em for power.
And in revolutions, we see... through the wonder if a hovercraft that suddenly loses it's need to HOVER OVER anything.... that there is a top to the clouds.... with sun... (Ahhhh.. MY EYES... MY SENSATIVE SUBTERRANEAN EYES) So all the machines needed to do is learn to fly... get solar collectors above the cloud line.. and wham... solar power galore.
Ok.. closing our eyes to that little.. umm.. oversight in the plot writing... we then have the nukes. The nukes.. which the humans used to darken the skies. Remember those.. right.. kinda key to the.. "plot". Now.. Kurtz pegs a point with the EMPs... why not make everything from baby rattles to toilet seats be able to emit an EMP. Hey... I've got a better idea... instead of using the vast number of atomic bombs to darken the sky.. why not just send em over to computer central... every atomic bomb emits its own EMP upon detonation... HUGE ones at that. Wouldn't even have to make it to the ground... a mid-air blast woulda done the trick several times over. Left it all a giant metal scrap yard. Oh.. wait.. that woulda meant the humans would have won. Can't have that happen.
Then there is the matrix. I assume you all are pretty computer savvy. Follow with me, if you will, the story of a giant mainframe computer without a rm command, a reboot button, a firewall, or even a FREAKIN ANTI-VIRUS SOFTWARE PACKAGE INSTALLED. This is a COMPUTER mastermind running a COMPUTER-GENERATED FANTASY WORLD who couldn't think of one simple command to get rid of Smith....
FORMAT C:\
SURELY they had some backup disks somewhere to reinstall the OS.
I mean.. come on... they are all computer programs.... what.. the architect couldn't just deltree C:\Matrix\Agents\Smith ?
They would lose the crops of humans they "need" for power. Ummm... Smith had em all anyway... and as it was the architect had to agree to let those that wanted to, go.. just to do what he could have done at any time without Neo's help. "We have to let most of the humans go... so from now on to conserve power I can't make my face out of millions of tiny squid machines. And everyone whose job it was to scuttle about aimlessly has been let go. We all have our sacrifices to make."
The machines didn't need Neo.. they needed McAfee... scan the matrix for computer programs containing or in entirety matching the bit description of the known program "Smith", quarantine, and whamo... problem solved. They can create an alternate reality, but not a patch.
Hmmmmmmmm... Maybe the Matrix will be written by the same people who are on the Temple of Elemental Evil management team at Atari.
So then we decide to ignore everything in the background story and just accept that it happened... for the sake of the eye candy. Hey.. nothing wrong with that... I did it. The problem is, the candy got old.. and the only thing left to pay attention to is the story... which unfortunately featured actors whose characters had suffered precise frontal lobotomies which left them with the emotional range of a chunk of coal.
As far as the death ending, eh... that didn't bother me... I mean the only difference visually between Neo alive and Neo dead was that he stopped posing.
Now... all that is left to do with the Matrix series is re-dub them with new voices and turn it into a comedy. Kinda like a Goth version of Kung-Pow. Now THAT I would pay full price to see!
Neo:
"Look.. I can fly"
"Whhhhooooooshhhhhh"
Smith:
"I can fly faster than you"
"Whhhoooooooooshhhhhh"
Both, high pitched, in flight:
"Wheeeeeeeeeeee"
Fade in music "Fighting in the Rain"
Both:
"We're FIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIGHTINGGGG IN THE RAAAAAAAAIN"
"JUUUUUUST FIIIIIIIIIIIIIGHTINGGGG IN THE RAAAAAAIN"
"WHAT A GLOOOOOOOOOORIOUS FEEEEEELLLLING"
"TO BE THIS INSAAAAAAAAANE"
"WHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE"
ICK.. SPOILERS BELOW.....
Yeah.. ok.. so I dragged Arislyn out to see it yesterday. So much for her not planning on seeing it, eh.
A review... well... what can I say but what was there to expect from two guys who just had to take three movies to prove that they can't write a plot to save their lives. The holes in all THREE movies were large enough to drive a machine city through. Revolutions was funny I'll give it that... I laughed my butt off at the slow-motion Neo punch on Smith... but funny isn't what the matrix was suppose to be.. so it was more laughing AT it instead of WITH it.
Now.. first off... yeah.. it was good eye candy... the first movie was the tastiest of them all... cause the eye candy was new and shiny and devoid of bite marks. Arrays of cameras.. all the dark and moody characters. And this movie had its share... it is worth seeing at a dollar theater if only to see some of the fight scenes with the hovercraft in the mechanical tube and the fights with the squids in the landing bay. Gotta admit.. pretty cool.
But... by Revolutions... it was like someone had offered to give you a piece of candy by spitting out the one they had been sucking on. OH LOOK... they are recreating the fight scene in the lobby of the government building... same columns.. same run and dodge tactics... only this time they are on the ceiling..... somehow it just isn't as cool. So though still interesting in places.. it had long stretches where I didn't mind getting up for more Coke.
And speaking of stretches... sheezz.. one rule of cinema.. no death scene that is to be taken seriously should be longer than Hamlets. Period. ESPECIALLY when there are HUGE METAL PIPES jutting through what would be the diaphragm. At least Hamlet was dying a slow lingering death by poison. Trinity, on the other hand, seemed to not suffer from that whole "need to breathe" thing while uttering her final 12 pages of dialogue.
I'm sure you've read Kurtz comments on making EVERYTHING able to create an EMP pulse. Just one small example of how badly the entire concept was written.
Starting all the way back in the first movie.... Morpheous tells us how the machines lived off of sunlight... energy created by nuclear fusion of the simplest, most basic, low output sort.. Hydrogen smashing into each other to create Helium. So... the humans nuked the world to block out the sun... which deprived them of their power... till they found that humans make good batteries.. when combined with a form of fusion. A form of fusion.. ummm.. that would be what they were USING BEFORE... there is no "form" of fusion that would produce less power than simple hydrogen to helium... they collide or they don't. The humans are what then... a curiosity? They sure as heck don't need em for power.
And in revolutions, we see... through the wonder if a hovercraft that suddenly loses it's need to HOVER OVER anything.... that there is a top to the clouds.... with sun... (Ahhhh.. MY EYES... MY SENSATIVE SUBTERRANEAN EYES) So all the machines needed to do is learn to fly... get solar collectors above the cloud line.. and wham... solar power galore.
Ok.. closing our eyes to that little.. umm.. oversight in the plot writing... we then have the nukes. The nukes.. which the humans used to darken the skies. Remember those.. right.. kinda key to the.. "plot". Now.. Kurtz pegs a point with the EMPs... why not make everything from baby rattles to toilet seats be able to emit an EMP. Hey... I've got a better idea... instead of using the vast number of atomic bombs to darken the sky.. why not just send em over to computer central... every atomic bomb emits its own EMP upon detonation... HUGE ones at that. Wouldn't even have to make it to the ground... a mid-air blast woulda done the trick several times over. Left it all a giant metal scrap yard. Oh.. wait.. that woulda meant the humans would have won. Can't have that happen.
Then there is the matrix. I assume you all are pretty computer savvy. Follow with me, if you will, the story of a giant mainframe computer without a rm command, a reboot button, a firewall, or even a FREAKIN ANTI-VIRUS SOFTWARE PACKAGE INSTALLED. This is a COMPUTER mastermind running a COMPUTER-GENERATED FANTASY WORLD who couldn't think of one simple command to get rid of Smith....
FORMAT C:\
SURELY they had some backup disks somewhere to reinstall the OS.
I mean.. come on... they are all computer programs.... what.. the architect couldn't just deltree C:\Matrix\Agents\Smith ?
They would lose the crops of humans they "need" for power. Ummm... Smith had em all anyway... and as it was the architect had to agree to let those that wanted to, go.. just to do what he could have done at any time without Neo's help. "We have to let most of the humans go... so from now on to conserve power I can't make my face out of millions of tiny squid machines. And everyone whose job it was to scuttle about aimlessly has been let go. We all have our sacrifices to make."
The machines didn't need Neo.. they needed McAfee... scan the matrix for computer programs containing or in entirety matching the bit description of the known program "Smith", quarantine, and whamo... problem solved. They can create an alternate reality, but not a patch.
Hmmmmmmmm... Maybe the Matrix will be written by the same people who are on the Temple of Elemental Evil management team at Atari.
So then we decide to ignore everything in the background story and just accept that it happened... for the sake of the eye candy. Hey.. nothing wrong with that... I did it. The problem is, the candy got old.. and the only thing left to pay attention to is the story... which unfortunately featured actors whose characters had suffered precise frontal lobotomies which left them with the emotional range of a chunk of coal.
As far as the death ending, eh... that didn't bother me... I mean the only difference visually between Neo alive and Neo dead was that he stopped posing.
Now... all that is left to do with the Matrix series is re-dub them with new voices and turn it into a comedy. Kinda like a Goth version of Kung-Pow. Now THAT I would pay full price to see!
Neo:
"Look.. I can fly"
"Whhhhooooooshhhhhh"
Smith:
"I can fly faster than you"
"Whhhoooooooooshhhhhh"
Both, high pitched, in flight:
"Wheeeeeeeeeeee"
Fade in music "Fighting in the Rain"
Both:
"We're FIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIGHTINGGGG IN THE RAAAAAAAAIN"
"JUUUUUUST FIIIIIIIIIIIIIGHTINGGGG IN THE RAAAAAAIN"
"WHAT A GLOOOOOOOOOORIOUS FEEEEEELLLLING"
"TO BE THIS INSAAAAAAAAANE"
"WHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE"
Matrix Revolutions - by Arislyn on 10:03 10 Nov 2003
Okay, I'll admit that I am glad Runt talked me into seeing it just for the amusement factor of the film. We must've spent a good hour giggling about it afterwards.
However, my sweetie left out one of the mistakes that was, in my mind, the most glaringly obvious:
When building a battlemech, do not put your pilot up front without any sort of protection. What were the designers thinking? "Okay...who do we not like? We need some meat-shields for our mechanical components."
Pilot: "Uhhmmm...you know, I'm not an engineer or anything, but that looks mighty open in the front. Isn't that dangerous?"
Designer: "Oh, don't worry. It's got roll bars. You're perfectly safe."
And, no. These were not frontend loaders like Ripley drove in Aliens. These things had big guns attached to them with locking compartments meant to hold ammunition. These were designed to be weapons. Even if they were modified frontend loaders.....guys....a little shielding in the front? Maybe? But then we don't get to see the pilots pop like ripe tomatoes, and where's the fun in that?
Okay, I'll admit that I am glad Runt talked me into seeing it just for the amusement factor of the film. We must've spent a good hour giggling about it afterwards.
However, my sweetie left out one of the mistakes that was, in my mind, the most glaringly obvious:
When building a battlemech, do not put your pilot up front without any sort of protection. What were the designers thinking? "Okay...who do we not like? We need some meat-shields for our mechanical components."
Pilot: "Uhhmmm...you know, I'm not an engineer or anything, but that looks mighty open in the front. Isn't that dangerous?"
Designer: "Oh, don't worry. It's got roll bars. You're perfectly safe."
And, no. These were not frontend loaders like Ripley drove in Aliens. These things had big guns attached to them with locking compartments meant to hold ammunition. These were designed to be weapons. Even if they were modified frontend loaders.....guys....a little shielding in the front? Maybe? But then we don't get to see the pilots pop like ripe tomatoes, and where's the fun in that?
Matrix Revolutions - by Kainja on 10:45 10 Nov 2003
I have one other question about Matrix Revolutions. But it has several parts.
1. Morpheus and Neo and the others want to free humanity from their prisons (meaning vats), right?
2. If a person dies in the matrix they die in real life, in their vats, right?
3. Agents can take over people in the matrix but when the agent is killed it reverts back to the original person, who is then dead for real in their vat, right?
4. Smith converted everyone in the matrix to Smith, right?
5. At the end of matrix revolutions, all the smiths blew up, right?
6. So, doesn't that mean that Neo killed everyone in their vats who he was originally supposed to save?
But then, I guess if they're dead they're free of their chains. Mission accomplished. Sounds like a government plan.
I have one other question about Matrix Revolutions. But it has several parts.
1. Morpheus and Neo and the others want to free humanity from their prisons (meaning vats), right?
2. If a person dies in the matrix they die in real life, in their vats, right?
3. Agents can take over people in the matrix but when the agent is killed it reverts back to the original person, who is then dead for real in their vat, right?
4. Smith converted everyone in the matrix to Smith, right?
5. At the end of matrix revolutions, all the smiths blew up, right?
6. So, doesn't that mean that Neo killed everyone in their vats who he was originally supposed to save?
But then, I guess if they're dead they're free of their chains. Mission accomplished. Sounds like a government plan.
Matrix Revolutions - by Brad on 12:59 10 Nov 2003
Excellent reviews guys! You have cemented my resolve to just rent it in DVD someday when I get around to it.
Excellent reviews guys! You have cemented my resolve to just rent it in DVD someday when I get around to it.
Matrix Revolutions - by Runt on 16:01 10 Nov 2003
I think waiting for DVD will mean missing the effect size has on making the visual scenes what they are.
I don't know that the hovercraft chases or the mech battles in the dock will have the same effect on a TV screen.. unless of course you have a surround sound system and a big TV. There are some movies that just simply require the big screen to live up to their full potential.... no matter how small that "full" is. And those scenes were, I think most will agree, pretty darn cool to watch.
Having paid matinee price for the movie (which is STILL like 5.50... I mean come on... back in MY DAY....) and going in with the concrete solid idea that it was going to blow big globs of monkey chunks in a million different directions, I felt I only slightly overpaid for admission. Granted.. the first 2/3 of the movie is a lot to sit through to get to the good visual stuff.
So... IMHO... find yourself a dollar theater and see it there. Still the same spectacular size and sound at a fraction of the price (Course now dollar theaters cost 1.99.....Back in MY Day.....). And you have MASSIVE opportunities for drink/popcorn refills and bathroom breaks!
I think waiting for DVD will mean missing the effect size has on making the visual scenes what they are.
I don't know that the hovercraft chases or the mech battles in the dock will have the same effect on a TV screen.. unless of course you have a surround sound system and a big TV. There are some movies that just simply require the big screen to live up to their full potential.... no matter how small that "full" is. And those scenes were, I think most will agree, pretty darn cool to watch.
Having paid matinee price for the movie (which is STILL like 5.50... I mean come on... back in MY DAY....) and going in with the concrete solid idea that it was going to blow big globs of monkey chunks in a million different directions, I felt I only slightly overpaid for admission. Granted.. the first 2/3 of the movie is a lot to sit through to get to the good visual stuff.
So... IMHO... find yourself a dollar theater and see it there. Still the same spectacular size and sound at a fraction of the price (Course now dollar theaters cost 1.99.....Back in MY Day.....). And you have MASSIVE opportunities for drink/popcorn refills and bathroom breaks!
Matrix Revolutions - by Luka on 13:25 02 Dec 2003
I haven't read all the replies to the topic, but it seems to me people were especting a little much from the sequals.Matrix was, first of all, a great action movie.Those who thought it trough know it was more, but basically, that's what it was. Reloaded and Revolutions are continuations of that theme.The first was new in subject. These weren't.Element of surprise mostly lost=disappointement!
So I say: enjoy the action and enter the Matrix(Never concieved to be "Citizen Kane").Have fun with it is my friendly piece of advice.
I haven't read all the replies to the topic, but it seems to me people were especting a little much from the sequals.Matrix was, first of all, a great action movie.Those who thought it trough know it was more, but basically, that's what it was. Reloaded and Revolutions are continuations of that theme.The first was new in subject. These weren't.Element of surprise mostly lost=disappointement!
So I say: enjoy the action and enter the Matrix(Never concieved to be "Citizen Kane").Have fun with it is my friendly piece of advice.