Book Bannings/Restrictions - by Arislyn on 12:34 17 Feb 2005
The whole idea of banning books always makes me shake my head. Here's a list of books restricted, banned, or challenged recently by schools.
Linkie-dinkie
You know, I'm not a parent so I'm not even remotely close to being an expert in this...or even experienced in it....but doesn't it ever occur to these people that perhaps the best thing to do is sit down and read these "questionable" books with their children? Seriously. If the parents have an issue with something in the book, why not read it and then talk about it with their kids? What better way to find out what they think and, if they find their children are learning something that they don't approve of, to tell them why they feel that Issue A is wrong.
The whole idea of banning books always makes me shake my head. Here's a list of books restricted, banned, or challenged recently by schools.
Linkie-dinkie
You know, I'm not a parent so I'm not even remotely close to being an expert in this...or even experienced in it....but doesn't it ever occur to these people that perhaps the best thing to do is sit down and read these "questionable" books with their children? Seriously. If the parents have an issue with something in the book, why not read it and then talk about it with their kids? What better way to find out what they think and, if they find their children are learning something that they don't approve of, to tell them why they feel that Issue A is wrong.
Book Bannings/Restrictions - by NoonChild on 06:08 18 Feb 2005
This reminds me of the film Flashdance *small Kevin Bacon clicky fingers kicky feet dance* where the community is so damaged by the deaths of some young people that they are scared of everything. There is a scene where the parents are trying to ban "Slaughter House 5" from the school, and KB's character says he's read it and thinks it has important issues - all the parents look at him like his is the most dangerous thing, a teen with his own opinions. Especially good scene as SH5 is a great book that really makes you think about the crazyness WWII, and banning it is madness. Also the adults had not read it, but were objecting to it blind.
This reminds me of the film Flashdance *small Kevin Bacon clicky fingers kicky feet dance* where the community is so damaged by the deaths of some young people that they are scared of everything. There is a scene where the parents are trying to ban "Slaughter House 5" from the school, and KB's character says he's read it and thinks it has important issues - all the parents look at him like his is the most dangerous thing, a teen with his own opinions. Especially good scene as SH5 is a great book that really makes you think about the crazyness WWII, and banning it is madness. Also the adults had not read it, but were objecting to it blind.
Book Bannings/Restrictions - by NoonChild on 06:19 18 Feb 2005
ALSO How can you ban a Biology text book because it talks about sexual organs etc. Why not ban the dictionary because it contains definitions of such things.
AND I thought the point of the USA was to allow all kinds of people to worship how they like without persecution - but you cant read a fantasy book about a boy wizard. I mean it's not a step by step guide to occult practises, it's a fairytale!
Its only a small amount of people...its only a small amount of people...its only a small amount of people... and BREATHE.
PS If you want to stop your kids reading Harry Potter you should do so on the grounds that it is highly derivative, quite badly written (although Ive been told she gets much better after the first book) and there are better books out there which didn't get all the marketing hype.
ALSO How can you ban a Biology text book because it talks about sexual organs etc. Why not ban the dictionary because it contains definitions of such things.
AND I thought the point of the USA was to allow all kinds of people to worship how they like without persecution - but you cant read a fantasy book about a boy wizard. I mean it's not a step by step guide to occult practises, it's a fairytale!
Its only a small amount of people...its only a small amount of people...its only a small amount of people... and BREATHE.
PS If you want to stop your kids reading Harry Potter you should do so on the grounds that it is highly derivative, quite badly written (although Ive been told she gets much better after the first book) and there are better books out there which didn't get all the marketing hype.
Book Bannings/Restrictions - by din on 07:39 18 Feb 2005
Here is my slighted point of view. It depends entirely on the age groups involved, and the community. The public schools are a public service, the school boards are elected by the public and what they teach is a reflection of the morals and sensibilities of the local people. (What actually happens is it reflects the morals and sensibilties of the outspoken because they will go to board meetings to b- and moan.)
This is tempered by hard requirements set by state education boards and more and more by the federal government.
There are things that i may not want my 6 year old to read, that I think would be fine for my 12 year old, and things I wouldn't want my 12 year old to read now, that would be fine when he is in his mid-teens, but where I'm at they [the two older age groups] share the same library, so maybe a little restriction is not a bad idea.
The other area which impossible to navigate is the witchcraft / evolution. It is a touchy subject and a social/religous/political trap which i can sum up in a sentence. 'You can say somebody isn't right, but you can't say they are wrong.'
So you have congregations and groups that any mention of 'witchcraft' in a positive light, even in fiction, is abhorrent to there religious views and the views they want their children to have. so they don't want them exposed to them in their public schools. So these books might be placed on 'restriction' maybe requiring a note from the parent. (I think HP is an extremely silly lightning rod for this sort of thing, but its popularity makes it so)
This sort of thing, looking at it purely from literature is sometimes laughable, but the same thought goes into the child of a devout Hindu family being expected to eat a public school lunch with meat in it, or a Muslim child having to eat a pork meal.
I personally think it is silly in most cases, but I see arguements for it. As long as it is handled correctly through the elected officials and consideration is given to both sides it is a parenting device. They are still children, or almost adults and ultimately the respinsablitly of their moral upbringing are their parents, even if they are wrong. The children are not in charge of their own destiny just yet.
And as Ari said, reading the book with the child maybe a method to go. If there is a book, like Tom Sawyer, that may be banned becasue it acurately reflects the views of people of that time, which we now feel is a little dated, we have them here to read at home and discuss, because Melanie and I take that as our responsibilty as parents and I wouldn't really want to trust the school to do explain the 'touchy' subjects of the book that they way my kids would understand, or at all.
I think I'm all over the place, sort of playing devil's advocate, and I have to stop. It is time to send these kids off to school. :P
Here is my slighted point of view. It depends entirely on the age groups involved, and the community. The public schools are a public service, the school boards are elected by the public and what they teach is a reflection of the morals and sensibilities of the local people. (What actually happens is it reflects the morals and sensibilties of the outspoken because they will go to board meetings to b- and moan.)
This is tempered by hard requirements set by state education boards and more and more by the federal government.
There are things that i may not want my 6 year old to read, that I think would be fine for my 12 year old, and things I wouldn't want my 12 year old to read now, that would be fine when he is in his mid-teens, but where I'm at they [the two older age groups] share the same library, so maybe a little restriction is not a bad idea.
The other area which impossible to navigate is the witchcraft / evolution. It is a touchy subject and a social/religous/political trap which i can sum up in a sentence. 'You can say somebody isn't right, but you can't say they are wrong.'
So you have congregations and groups that any mention of 'witchcraft' in a positive light, even in fiction, is abhorrent to there religious views and the views they want their children to have. so they don't want them exposed to them in their public schools. So these books might be placed on 'restriction' maybe requiring a note from the parent. (I think HP is an extremely silly lightning rod for this sort of thing, but its popularity makes it so)
This sort of thing, looking at it purely from literature is sometimes laughable, but the same thought goes into the child of a devout Hindu family being expected to eat a public school lunch with meat in it, or a Muslim child having to eat a pork meal.
I personally think it is silly in most cases, but I see arguements for it. As long as it is handled correctly through the elected officials and consideration is given to both sides it is a parenting device. They are still children, or almost adults and ultimately the respinsablitly of their moral upbringing are their parents, even if they are wrong. The children are not in charge of their own destiny just yet.
And as Ari said, reading the book with the child maybe a method to go. If there is a book, like Tom Sawyer, that may be banned becasue it acurately reflects the views of people of that time, which we now feel is a little dated, we have them here to read at home and discuss, because Melanie and I take that as our responsibilty as parents and I wouldn't really want to trust the school to do explain the 'touchy' subjects of the book that they way my kids would understand, or at all.
I think I'm all over the place, sort of playing devil's advocate, and I have to stop. It is time to send these kids off to school. :P
Book Bannings/Restrictions - by Arislyn on 08:22 18 Feb 2005
Oh, I definitely agree that the appropriateness of material is age dependant. No agruments, there.
However, to ban a book from schools entirely because it depicts views/morals which were appropriate for their time but are dated now is silly. Sure, it's fiction, but it is fiction that reflects our history. Just because something in our history is ugly (such as slavery) doesn't mean it should be ignored or forgotten, in my opinion. It should definitely be remembered, lest it happens again. These are the sort of things that we learn from.
*chuckles* NC: Yeah, the US is about freedom. Unfortunately, that freedom goes both ways. I'm free to read whatever I want, and other people are free to declare my reading material to be the work of Beezlebub himself. ("Darn you and your dangling participles, Devilman!") The thing to remember is that just because a book is banned in a school setting doesn't mean that, if you want it, you can't walk down to the local Barnes and Noble and buy it yourself....or even go to the public library and get it.
I'm with you on the whole biology text thing, though. That's the epitome of silliness. "Oh, no! They're showing completely non-erotic, sections of the female reproductive tract and slices of penis!" I'm sorry, but anyone who can look at/read a biology text and find it in any way inappropriate is just crazy. (And, when I was in school at least, by the time they were covering the reproductive tract, I was a teenager. I feel that is plenty old enough to learn how all the plumbing works.)
Oh, I definitely agree that the appropriateness of material is age dependant. No agruments, there.
However, to ban a book from schools entirely because it depicts views/morals which were appropriate for their time but are dated now is silly. Sure, it's fiction, but it is fiction that reflects our history. Just because something in our history is ugly (such as slavery) doesn't mean it should be ignored or forgotten, in my opinion. It should definitely be remembered, lest it happens again. These are the sort of things that we learn from.
*chuckles* NC: Yeah, the US is about freedom. Unfortunately, that freedom goes both ways. I'm free to read whatever I want, and other people are free to declare my reading material to be the work of Beezlebub himself. ("Darn you and your dangling participles, Devilman!") The thing to remember is that just because a book is banned in a school setting doesn't mean that, if you want it, you can't walk down to the local Barnes and Noble and buy it yourself....or even go to the public library and get it.
I'm with you on the whole biology text thing, though. That's the epitome of silliness. "Oh, no! They're showing completely non-erotic, sections of the female reproductive tract and slices of penis!" I'm sorry, but anyone who can look at/read a biology text and find it in any way inappropriate is just crazy. (And, when I was in school at least, by the time they were covering the reproductive tract, I was a teenager. I feel that is plenty old enough to learn how all the plumbing works.)
Book Bannings/Restrictions - by holsfisher on 12:38 26 Feb 2005
Hmm, I don't think it is up to the schools to ban books at all.
I could already read by the time I started school, and purely in reading terms, the books aimed at my age were always way below my capabilities (I lived on a little Island with very few kids, reading stopped my from dying of boredom) so I read books that really weren't aimed at seven year olds, or twelve year olds or whatever, and for all intents and purposes I stopped reading teenage fiction at fourteen and just read "adult" books.
However, this didn't do me any harm! Reading "Interview With the Vampire" at eleven didn't give me wierd ideas, and I didn't run out to have sex with strangers at fifteen just because I had read "Les Liasons Dangereuses". In fact, I think that reading such a wide range of books gave me a more realistic view of the world, especially boks like "Someone elses baby" by Geraldine Kaye - about teenage pregnancy. If you wait till sixteen to read it, then it might well be too late to be affected by it, whereas if, like me you read it at nine, you'll be aware of the negative AND positive sides of many situations before you have to deal with them in real life.
While I appreciate that many parents want control over what their children read, people have to be more realistic about modern kids - they watch movies filled with blood and guts, and watch Eastenders or Sunset Beach with mum even though these shows deal with all sorts of "adult" issues. Limiting what children can read just makes the forbidden fruit more appealling, as I can remember from when a copy of "A Clockwork Orange" was secretly passed from child to child in my primary 5 class.
And having books some parents would dissarove of in the school library isn't like
- its more like banning the entire school from eating anything cooked with butter, just because one child in the school is a vegan! If parents have a good relationship with their children then they'll know what their kids are reading anyway, and will be able to say, "What are you reading at school" then discuss the issues with them.
Don't get me wrong - I'm not saying that we should give five and six year olds books like "The Story of " to read!!!! I just think that appropriate reading material is a really varied thing - some kids are ready to read "I know why the caged bird sings" and can deal with the issues arising from it (including child abuse) when they are ten, and others wont be ready till their fifteen, but the ten year old who cant cope with these issues wont be attracted to the book, they'll want to read Sweet Valley High, and in any case if they have a good teacher, s/he will be able to look at the book and the child and say "I don't think you'll like this" or "Why don't you read - instead". We can't teach children to become open minded adults if we limit the way in which they interact with the world by removing "difficult" books.
Hmm, I don't think it is up to the schools to ban books at all.
I could already read by the time I started school, and purely in reading terms, the books aimed at my age were always way below my capabilities (I lived on a little Island with very few kids, reading stopped my from dying of boredom) so I read books that really weren't aimed at seven year olds, or twelve year olds or whatever, and for all intents and purposes I stopped reading teenage fiction at fourteen and just read "adult" books.
However, this didn't do me any harm! Reading "Interview With the Vampire" at eleven didn't give me wierd ideas, and I didn't run out to have sex with strangers at fifteen just because I had read "Les Liasons Dangereuses". In fact, I think that reading such a wide range of books gave me a more realistic view of the world, especially boks like "Someone elses baby" by Geraldine Kaye - about teenage pregnancy. If you wait till sixteen to read it, then it might well be too late to be affected by it, whereas if, like me you read it at nine, you'll be aware of the negative AND positive sides of many situations before you have to deal with them in real life.
While I appreciate that many parents want control over what their children read, people have to be more realistic about modern kids - they watch movies filled with blood and guts, and watch Eastenders or Sunset Beach with mum even though these shows deal with all sorts of "adult" issues. Limiting what children can read just makes the forbidden fruit more appealling, as I can remember from when a copy of "A Clockwork Orange" was secretly passed from child to child in my primary 5 class.
And having books some parents would dissarove of in the school library isn't like
| Quote |
| the child of a devout Hindu family being expected to eat a public school lunch with meat in it, or a Muslim child having to eat a pork meal. |
- its more like banning the entire school from eating anything cooked with butter, just because one child in the school is a vegan! If parents have a good relationship with their children then they'll know what their kids are reading anyway, and will be able to say, "What are you reading at school" then discuss the issues with them.
Don't get me wrong - I'm not saying that we should give five and six year olds books like "The Story of " to read!!!! I just think that appropriate reading material is a really varied thing - some kids are ready to read "I know why the caged bird sings" and can deal with the issues arising from it (including child abuse) when they are ten, and others wont be ready till their fifteen, but the ten year old who cant cope with these issues wont be attracted to the book, they'll want to read Sweet Valley High, and in any case if they have a good teacher, s/he will be able to look at the book and the child and say "I don't think you'll like this" or "Why don't you read - instead". We can't teach children to become open minded adults if we limit the way in which they interact with the world by removing "difficult" books.
Book Bannings/Restrictions - by NoonChild on 06:59 28 Feb 2005
Did anyone else huddle wide eyed around a friends copy of "Forever" by Judy Blume thinking it was sooooooooo grown up. I was about 10, but my friends sisters were older so they had much more "fun" books. Strangely when I was 13 I asked my mum if I could get it for a Birthday and she said no (not knowing I'd already read all the dirty bits out of context, and a bit of context would have more sensibly shown me the issues surrounding all the sexy stuff). This really shocked me as it had not occured to me that my mum would disapprove - my parents pretend to be so liberal.
Did anyone else huddle wide eyed around a friends copy of "Forever" by Judy Blume thinking it was sooooooooo grown up. I was about 10, but my friends sisters were older so they had much more "fun" books. Strangely when I was 13 I asked my mum if I could get it for a Birthday and she said no (not knowing I'd already read all the dirty bits out of context, and a bit of context would have more sensibly shown me the issues surrounding all the sexy stuff). This really shocked me as it had not occured to me that my mum would disapprove - my parents pretend to be so liberal.
Book Bannings/Restrictions - by Arislyn on 08:02 28 Feb 2005
I never read Forever.
My parents were always very open with me about sex. They didn't lie to me about where babies come from, they never hid the fact that they were still very much in love and enjoyed each other.....not that they just whipped it all out in front of me or anything. They're not sickos.
But, you know how some people can't imagine their parents having sex? I never had that problem because I knew they did. I could hear them at night. And, honestly, that's made me a happy person because I knew (and still know) that my parent's relationship is strong and full of love. (Hurray, hippy parents!!)
But, you know what I find so weird? Despite the fact that they were open with me, they didn't want me reading about sex. They would go through any books that I read and cut out any pages that had anything sexual in them before handing them over. Hehe! Not that that did any good, mind you. You would think that as voracious a reader as I am, Mom would've thought to hide her romance novels, but she never did. So, I read my fill about "throbbing bits" without them realizing it....and promptly decided that romance novels were boring and silly and went back to reading fantasy/sci-fi.
I never read Forever.
My parents were always very open with me about sex. They didn't lie to me about where babies come from, they never hid the fact that they were still very much in love and enjoyed each other.....not that they just whipped it all out in front of me or anything. They're not sickos.
But, you know how some people can't imagine their parents having sex? I never had that problem because I knew they did. I could hear them at night. And, honestly, that's made me a happy person because I knew (and still know) that my parent's relationship is strong and full of love. (Hurray, hippy parents!!)But, you know what I find so weird? Despite the fact that they were open with me, they didn't want me reading about sex. They would go through any books that I read and cut out any pages that had anything sexual in them before handing them over. Hehe! Not that that did any good, mind you. You would think that as voracious a reader as I am, Mom would've thought to hide her romance novels, but she never did. So, I read my fill about "throbbing bits" without them realizing it....and promptly decided that romance novels were boring and silly and went back to reading fantasy/sci-fi.